Finally, I feel like I’m getting back in shape after the holidays. Sunday I ran, yesterday I ran again for 3 miles and then did 9 x 100s, forcing myself to run moderately (AKA slow) – between 18 – 24 seconds each, and today, Internet People, was extreme arm & ab torture with a 40 minute bike ride thrown in just for fun. And yes, my seat is too low – especially with the new stem – I’ll get my chef on that right away.
Arms & Abs Feb 3 from Runner Susan on Vimeo.
Seat too low from Runner Susan on Vimeo.
Just looking at your side view — I don’t think your seat is too low. At 6:00 you have a slight bend in your knee with your foot parallel to the ground which is how it should be …. when you drop your heel it extends the leg even further to where it looks locked out. You want the slight bend. With that said your fit looks wrong at 3:00 – I think your knee is too far forward which means your fore and aft needs to be adjusted which once adjusted will effect the height. Have hub or bike shop drop a plumb bob from your knee to your pedal spindle just to eye ball it – hard to say from a video – your still shot looks good
I agree with Betty. Looks like it’s just fine. Anything higher would leave you with practically a straight leg on the 6:00 position. If you have a chance to check it out, I would before changing anything.
Looks good Susan.
Rinus
I thought the seat was okay then all the Internet People **cough*psimet*cough*ewen*cough*flatman** kept saying it was too low, then I started to believe them. When will I learn? When, oh when?
Betty, I have no clue what a fore or aft is, but I’ll have my chef check into it.
……It’s too low. Can’t run the video at work, but basically the look of the still showing in the video spot shows me your leg is too high at the top of the stroke.
Looking at your other stills you dropped your heel making it almost impossible to tell where the position really is ->making it look like you have the correct extension.
Move it up. 1cm at most at a time. When you start rocking your hips – not in that way you dirty internet people – then drop it 1/2 a cm.
Fore-aft based on KOPS (Knee Over Pedal Spindle) is a myth and has been proven so many times over the years, but it’s that fit “rule” that gets passed down generation to generation like it’s made out of gold….but it’s like cyclists saying they shave their legs for aerodynamics….it’s simply not true. We do it because that’s what you do.
Fore Aft changes should be made to lessen knee stress and to compensate for saddle heights that can not be achieved – example: I can not ride at the height I should ride at. I ride too low. This is because of man issues that get aggravated. Sorry but you talk about your vag. As a result I ride lower, but with the saddle pushed back further to compensate. This gives me proper extension on a lower saddle. It sucks, but it works.
I’ll play the video at home and see if I see anything that would change my mind on this.
Besides…who are you going to listen to? A bunch of rec riders/runners/”try”-athletes or a bunch of crusty road weenies?
Kudos on the chef keeping you in prime kit. He knows how to de-Fred you well.
Damn girl, I don’t know where you find the time in the day for all the things you do. Workouts, run, bikes and swim and most of them all in the same day. Plus mom, wife and job. Maybe the better than crappy Illinois weather helps. You are inspiring. I’d like to do Boston as well and I have 1.5 hours to kill somehow. Probably not, but if I ever get to 4hrs, I will try for that extra 30.
Lookin’ good! lookin’ good.
I think my bike is too big for me. I need a schwinn with a banana seat like I had when I was 8.
Getting back in shape is hard sometimes (depending on how much you stop), but once you get back into it, you recover faster and in no time you’re back to where you were before. Nice pictures & videos to go w/ the post.
Nothing beats a banana seat. So comfy! Fore-aft is just moving your seat forward or backward – it can slide along the rails once you loosen the screw. Just like on a spin bike when you sit too close or too far away from the handles you move the seat to fix it. You should start neutral (plumb bob dropped from knee at 3:00 should center on pedal spindle). Like I said once you move the seat you will have to slightly adjust the height again. Ain’t this fun? I am sure the chef knows all about it. Save yourself some aggravation and make an appt with a certified bike fit expert. Actually, you should do it like once a year cuz your position changes as you become more or less fit. What size frame did you get?
BettyBetty needs to do a U.S. tour. she can stop in d.c. first and then head for texas. she is way smart!
don’t bike shops have specialists that can tell you if your seat is too low, bust too big, undies too lacy? i’d go with what they say because photos are always a bit tricky. take me. in real life, i’m ueberhot, but in photos, i just look dorky. never trust a photo.
oh, and i’m 2 hours from winning (i hope) my new 3-speed electra on ebay. oooh, three whole speeds! and streamers. should i get rollers for it?
Hey BB…”plumb bob dropped from knee at 3:00 should center on pedal spindle” – again…KOPS, which is what you’re describing, is a myth that is spewed by shop rats who know no better. Don’t believe me? Do some research on it. Here’s a great summation by the late great Sheldon of Keith Bontrager’s work to disprove KOPS fore-aft positioning. I know you Trek cult members know who Bontrager is….his name is on your bars, stem, wheels, cranks, etc…
Also wondering what you consider to be a “certified bike fit expert”? Under what system or school of thought? Serotta? Specialized? Andy Pruitt’s? Fit Kit? Retul? There is no scientific solution to fit. If there was then there would also be a scientifically perfect saddle or pair of bibs. Achieving the right fit – if you can’t do it yourself – involves establishing a relationship with someone who will listen to your needs, address your fitness and flexibility limitations, etc.
Last time I saw a “fit expert” get ahold of an advanced cyclist I saw them lose 1/2 a season to stress related injuries caused by the fit changes.
Sorry about the rant, but I just get peeved when people fail to see that most of the people working on fits are simply entry level retail sales people that have only been exposed to one school of thought…the one they sell.
Watched the video…you saddle is too low. Not by much, but it needs to move up. You can see it just as you pedal away after passing the camera. Hard to tell fore-aft without seeing you in person. If you don’t want to raise your saddle then slide it back a bit to help compensate.
Forgot to post the link to the article…
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/kops.html
Cough* Why weren’t you listening to Cindy? She told you to keep pedaling, but you coasted past like you used to do on the banana seat bike! We wanted vision of you pedaling 🙂
Actually, it doesn’t look too bad. Your heel is down, so if it were up there’d be a slight bend at the knee. I’m thinking maybe your cranks are too long, which might be bringing your knee up too high when it’s in the up position. Ask Psimet, Betty or Chef about this. I’m just a runner.
I see the problem, you have bike under your arse, no need for that thing RUNNNER Susan!
Quit pushing your heel down like that. It is distorting your leg extension…I agree with Psimet. But who you calling “crusty”? He may be right. Try sliding your saddle back a hair.
It is hard to tell your fit with your ankle dropping so low. Keep it up to level or just above the pedal as it comes around. No position will fit you if you don’t keep your feet flat-ish. Imagine scraping crap off your shoe as your foot comes through from the 5-7 o’clock position at the bottom of the stroke. It takes a while to get used to, but then it just becomes natural.
Also, don’t listen to anything the internet people have to say. (Including me) Videos and pics don’t say a damn thing about your comfort and flexibility, which are just as important as anything else when fitting.
Psimet can put you in a perfect position, but it may not be comfortable, so there is no point. Get it checked out by a real pro. In person.
One last thing. Most bike fit stats are based on professional riders, not recreational or fitness cyclists. A pro cyclist is going to have a completely different bike fit and body composition, so comparing your bike fit to how Lance or anyone else rides theirs is complete apples and oranges.
That is all. 🙂
Susan, Perhaps this is the way ;-).
http://videos.streetfire.net/video/this-is-hilarious-burnout_55292.htm
You look pretty snazzy on that bike! But definitely take any advice that tells you to get a bike fit…best investment you can make. You will love the Hotter-n-Hell Hundred. I may not make it this year 🙁 It completely depends on how I feel after doing Leadville.
Suz,
I got nothin’! I am afterall just the photographer, videographer and weight room torturer! Sorry! Maybe we should just ride our bikes and not worry about the little things!
you internet people, why do you make psimet so mad? wait, how do i become internet people? i want too.
aham is good at making me mad too. Does it every time he rides away from me. Not this year. You hear me aham??!!
Jamie, I think you misread my tone. I was saying exactly what you are trying to say…the ‘rules’ don’t work for many many riders. Unfortunately many of the ‘pro’ fitters are just schmoos in a shop who only know what they were taught by their flagship manufacturer.
A real ‘pro’ fitter is one that uses many different methods to get to a solid base position and then works from there based on your input…not by dropping plumb bobs everytime you get on the bike. We’re saying the same thing, but I want to make sure people understand that just because someone works in a shop does NOT make them remotely qualified to give fit advice. Not all ‘fitters’ are created equal.
In general if it hurts then something is wrong.
I like the crank length question. Luckily with Shimano’s newer offerings you can readily find 165mm cranks. Susan as you put on mileage try to see if your hip joints gets sore/aggravated towards the end of longer rides. If so it could be an indication that your cranks are too long…..
….but just start with good saddle placement. The rest (stem, bars, cranks, etc) falls into place easier. Just keep in mind that the 3 contact points between rider and machine do NOT have solid scientific solutions that help everyone find the answer to their fit questions. Those contact points have to be worked out by trial and error on a rider by rider basis.
I know nothing baout running, but I am sure there are probably 20 different schools of thought about the proper body mechanics of running, and shoe design. All of them are nice for entertainment, but in the end the one that is right is the one that actually works for you in application.
I’m just jealous that your issue is keeping your heel down. Mine is riding like a ballerina and there’s no better way to lose power.
I’m with psmit – raise the seat just a tiny bit – 1 cm and see if it feels better. I know my seat is still not right because my left knee hurts after a long run. Working on it but all you can do (short of finding a REAL fit expert) is change things little by little and work on your pedal stroke.
So how do you ride with your heel down like that on rollers? You need to hang on to the wall and do 1 leg drills to get your stroke right. Or you could get a cheap stationary trainer.